I was at a gathering and the subject got onto a certain deprogramming
system popular in the 1970s and I said I had just read three books about
it, and practically everybody else suddenly had to spew out everything
they thought they knew about it at me which was all basically weird
reactionary prejudices based on hearsayand legend, and amplified by
their own control-fears and power-envy. Like that anybody who starts or
heads any kind of deprogramming, spiritual discipline, or
self-improvement organization can only be doing it for money, power and
sex, and it's all a colossal control/ego trip designed to cheat people.
I could only say you know what, that's weird because what you're saying
is nothing like anything I read in any of those books. In response to
that they just tried to reinforce and justify their prejudices. Which
were based on NO KNOWLEDGE of the topic. I was the only one there who
really knew anything, but they had to tell me all about it. That's
weird. They didn't know they were really just talking about themselves.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: you know what's weird
From: virtualole@aol.com (VirtualOle)
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Date: Sat, Apr 1, 2000 8:12 AM
Message-ID: <20000401071235.03765.00000279@ng-fs1.aol.com>
Praise "Bob" !!!!
Neslo,
I think it's really important that you know that I have noticed the same weird
thing about people and I am honestly grateful that you mentioned it.
Especially:
>They didn't know they were really just talking about themselves.
But in general:
>and practically everybody else suddenly had to spew out everything
>they thought they knew about it at me which was all basically weird
>reactionary prejudices based on hearsayand legend, and amplified by
>their own control-fears and power-envy. <snip>
> In response to
>that they just tried to reinforce and justify their prejudices. Which
>were based on NO KNOWLEDGE of the topic. I was the only one there who
>really knew anything, but they had to tell me all about it. That's
>weird. They didn't know they were really just talking about themselves.
-------------------------------
Oleworld:
http://member.aol.com/VirtualOle/world.html
Ole Olson, P.O. Box 592, Ishpeming, MI 49849
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: you know what's weird
From: kevbob@ecsis.net (kevbob)
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Date: Sat, Apr 1, 2000 1:51 PM
Message-ID: <secdpjj2938@corp.supernews.com>
nenslo@tonyaharding.org (ePRONO) posted to alt.slack on Sat, 01 Apr
2000 09:56:10 GMT with <38E5C7B9.242@subgenius.com>
> They didn't know they were really just talking about
> themselves.
wow.
that statement says a lot.
thank you for opening the door to your innerself for us.
--
"oo ee oo ah ah twingtwang wallawalla bingbang,
oo ee oo ah ah twingtwang wallawalla bingbang oh yah!
oo ee oo ah ah B I N G O, oo ee oo ah ah E I E I O" Clutch
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: you know what's weird
From: ePRONO <nenslo@subgenius.com>
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Reply-To: nenslo@tonyaharding.org
Date: Sat, Apr 1, 2000 3:09 PM
Message-ID: <38E6496A.4EE5@subgenius.com>
Popess Lilith von Fraumench wrote:
>
> In article <38E5C7B9.242@subgenius.com>, ePRONO <nenslo@subgenius.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I was the only one there who really knew anything,
>
> "Really" meaning you read it in a few books?
>
A few books, a few magazines, paying attention, keeping notes in a
cardfile for fifteen years, going to the library and looking things up,
comparing sources and trying to sort out the reactionism and hyperbole
from what appears to be nearly factual, stuff like that. In contrast to
having heard one or two things about it once, never tried to find out if
they were true or not, and repeated them as one's sole knowledge base on
the topic, as proof that ALL MIND CONTROL CULTS ARE THE SAME and PEOPLE
WHO ARE INTO "SELF-IMPROVEMENT" ARE SUCKERS. So yeah. I was the LEAST
ignorant person there, on that topic anyway.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: you know what's weird
From: Popess Lilith von Fraumench <lilith@ZubJenius.com>
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Date: Sat, Apr 1, 2000 7:26 PM
Message-ID: <010420001526572978%lilith@ZubJenius.com>
In article <38E6496A.4EE5@subgenius.com>, ePRONO <nenslo@subgenius.com>
wrote:
> Popess Lilith von Fraumench wrote:
> >
> > In article <38E5C7B9.242@subgenius.com>, ePRONO <nenslo@subgenius.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I was the only one there who really knew anything,
> >
> > "Really" meaning you read it in a few books?
> >
>
> A few books, a few magazines, paying attention, keeping notes in a
> cardfile for fifteen years, going to the library and looking things up,
> comparing sources and trying to sort out the reactionism and hyperbole
> from what appears to be nearly factual, stuff like that. In contrast to
> having heard one or two things about it once, never tried to find out if
> they were true or not, and repeated them as one's sole knowledge base on
> the topic, as proof that ALL MIND CONTROL CULTS ARE THE SAME and PEOPLE
> WHO ARE INTO "SELF-IMPROVEMENT" ARE SUCKERS. So yeah. I was the LEAST
> ignorant person there, on that topic anyway.
On reflection, I think I might've made some comment like, "That's an
awfully dogmatic statement you're making. You sure you're not part of a
cult?"
The Prophet Lilith
--
Her Ladyship Rev. Dkr. St. Popess Lilith von Fraumench, Esquire, Inc.
== Prophet--Stage Manager Of The EndTimes--Corrective Phrenologist ==
=!APOCALEPSY NOW! SEATTLE DEVIVAL APRIL 13 BALLARD FIREHOUSE SEATTLE=
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: you know what's weird
From: ePRONO <nenslo@subgenius.com>
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Reply-To: nenslo@tonyaharding.org
Date: Sat, Apr 1, 2000 7:56 PM
Message-ID: <38E68C9F.6DD2@subgenius.com>
ePRONO wrote:
>
> Popess Lilith von Fraumench wrote:
> >
> > In article <38E5C7B9.242@subgenius.com>, ePRONO <nenslo@subgenius.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I was the only one there who really knew anything,
> >
> > "Really" meaning you read it in a few books?
> >
>
> A few books, a few magazines, paying attention, keeping notes in a
> cardfile for fifteen years, going to the library and looking things up,
> comparing sources and trying to sort out the reactionism and hyperbole
> from what appears to be nearly factual, stuff like that. In contrast to
> having heard one or two things about it once, never tried to find out if
> they were true or not, and repeated them as one's sole knowledge base on
> the topic, as proof that ALL MIND CONTROL CULTS ARE THE SAME and PEOPLE
> WHO ARE INTO "SELF-IMPROVEMENT" ARE SUCKERS. So yeah. I was the LEAST
> ignorant person there, on that topic anyway.
Oh yeah, I forgot to add attending a lecture by the author of the only
published biography of the founder of the organization in question.
You see, where I differ from the great majority of featherless bipeds
(and I know there are those who truly appreciate this about me) is that
I don't spout off about things I know nothing about. And I don't often
spout off about things I DO know something about, since most people are
aware on some level that they don't really know what they are talking
about and that most people are the same way so anyone who does spout off
is treated as one of the ignorant blowhards. Usually I restrain myself
to meta-comments like "Well, I've actually done some research on that
topic and found that there's a lot more to it than that." Then if
anybody asks me I tell them a few things.
This whole thing manifests itself a lot in relation to belief systems,
"cults," and people's fears and prejudices about them, as we've seen
here on many occasions. For example, most of the Anti-Scientologists
have never actually read any of the scientology literature except maybe
to scan for things which, taken out of context, make LRH look crazy or
stupid. Of which there are many many many, and any jackass can do it.
Or to find things which support their preconceptions. Rarely will any
one of them set out to discover what there is about Scientology that
APPEALS to people, what it is that makes people believe they have
benefited greatly from it and their lives are improved and the money
they gave the church was well-spent. In fact any evidence that anyone
really benefits from Scientology is discounted or ignored since it
doesn't support their preconceptions and prejudices. Or for another
example the earnest young fellow who posted here asking for information
about the evil meditation cult which was advertising in his town and
found it difficult to accept any information which did not support his
preconception that it was an evil cult. His prejudices told him that a
person who suggests that other persons meditate upon his picture must be
doing it as an ego/power trip - yet the reality of meditation is that
the OBJECT of meditation is irrelevant, since the result of continued
concentration on a single object is the disappearance of that object
from the field of perception. Even science agrees that's a fact!
I just think it's funny how people don't know the difference between
opinion and knowledge, belief and experience. It's far easier to have
an opinion based on emotional reaction than to have knowledge based on
accumulated and analysed information. Belief is not experience - if you
experience something, you don't believe it any more - you only KNOW IT.
And, as I have said so often, all you can do is spend the rest of your
life wishing you could forget.
You may go now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: you know what's weird
From: friday@fridayjones.com (Friday Jones)
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Date: Sun, Apr 2, 2000 12:28 PM
Message-ID: <friday-ya02408000R0204001228420001@news.tiac.net>
In article <38E6496A.4EE5@subgenius.com>, nenslo@tonyaharding.org wrote:
>Popess Lilith von Fraumench wrote:
>>
>> In article <38E5C7B9.242@subgenius.com>, ePRONO <nenslo@subgenius.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I was the only one there who really knew anything,
>>
>> "Really" meaning you read it in a few books?
>>
>
>A few books, a few magazines, paying attention, keeping notes in a
>cardfile for fifteen years, going to the library and looking things up,
>comparing sources and trying to sort out the reactionism and hyperbole
>from what appears to be nearly factual, stuff like that. In contrast to
>having heard one or two things about it once, never tried to find out if
>they were true or not, and repeated them as one's sole knowledge base on
>the topic, as proof that ALL MIND CONTROL CULTS ARE THE SAME and PEOPLE
>WHO ARE INTO "SELF-IMPROVEMENT" ARE SUCKERS. So yeah. I was the LEAST
>ignorant person there, on that topic anyway.
Why should I want to improve myself? It's everyone ELSE who has things
wrong with them.
Can't I start a cult devoted to correcting the OTHERS?
--
Eternal salvation or TRIPLE your money back!
www.subgenius.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: you know what's weird
From: jimvan@gate.net (Jim Vandewalker)
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Date: Sun, Apr 2, 2000 11:24 PM
Message-ID: <jimvan-ya023080000204002324250001@news.newsguy.com>
In article <38E68C9F.6DD2@subgenius.com>, nenslo@tonyaharding.org wrote:
{
{ I just think it's funny how people don't know the difference between
{ opinion and knowledge, belief and experience.
Some of this mayhave to do with developmental level. I don't mean the
retarded=> dull normal=> normal=> bright=> highly intelligent=> genius kind
of thing but more like Piaget's stages. I can't remember all of them now
but as a data point I have seen on more than one occasion people who are
unable to understand the idea of a direct quotation.
"What did he say then?"
"He said he was gonna beat me up."
"What exactly did he say?"
"He said he was gonna beat me up."
"Yes, but what words did he use?"
"That's what he said, he said he was gonna beat me up."
Many, maybe even most people are unable to understand the notion of
ordinary exposition and argument and cannot distinguish between fact and
opinion. Nor can they explain why they hold certain opinions or on on what
basis they beleive certain things to be facts.
The above is an opinion based on twenty-five years of listening to people
testify in court about supposed facts and reading reports written by
college graduates which were supposed to be about specific events, but in
which the writers very frequently or never said how they came to know the
things which they state as facts and never gave any support for the
conclusions which they drew.
It is not a conclusion because the sample size is too small to draw a
reasonable conclusion about "most people." But it is useful in most
circumstances to act as if it were true, for the reasons NENSLO gave in his
first post.
{ It's far easier to have
{ an opinion based on emotional reaction than to have knowledge based on
{ accumulated and analysed information.
--
Jim the Dead Guy
Original file name: you know what's weird
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