John Ashcroft: Evangelical, Fascist and Coward

From: nu-monet <nothing@succeeds.com>
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Reply-To: like.excess@sex.org
Date: Sat, Dec 15, 2001 1:54 PM

http://www.thenewrepublic.com/122401/notebook122401.html

John Ashcroft's testimony before the Senate Judiciary
Committee last week--during which he declared that his
critics "only aid terrorists, for they erode our
national unity and diminish our resolve"--was
despicable. And not just for the obvious reasons.

Ashcroft, you see, is the last person who should be
accusing others of undermining a war effort, given his
own sorry performance during the Vietnam War. While
attending Yale and then the University of Chicago Law
School in the 1960s, Ashcroft repeatedly sought and
received student deferments from his local draft board
in Springfield, Missouri.

In this, Ashcroft was hardly unique. But, as The Boston
Globe reported last January, when Ashcroft graduated
from law school in 1967 he took the far less common step
of seeking an occupational deferment granted to those
who hold critical civilian jobs. (Out of 35 million men
registered with the Selective Service in 1967, only
264,000 received occupational deferments.)

The "critical" job in question? Teaching business law
to undergrads at Southwest Missouri State University--
an assignment he lined up with the help of a family
friend. Although Ashcroft's draft board had already
earmarked him for induction--indeed, Ashcroft had
already passed his pre-induction physical--the board
reversed itself and granted the deferment, and Ashcroft
spent the rest of the Vietnam War in Missouri, safe and
sound. And quiet: Although Ashcroft was clearly eager to
avoid going to Vietnam, he never protested the war.

At least those people Ashcroft now brands traitors have
the courage to voice their dissent.

--
$
There is no nu-monet there is only Zuul.
$
The Anti-Limerick, by nu-monet:

There was a young man with an orange,
Who kept that there orange for a month,
It didn't turn silver,
It turned kinda purple,
And that there was one spoiled orange.
$
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Subject: Re: John Ashcroft: Evangelical, Fascist *and* Coward
From: mshotz@aol.comnospam (James T. Rex King of the Monsters)
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Date: Sun, Dec 16, 2001 3:12 PM
Message-ID: <20011216151211.06364.00000422@mb-cs.aol.com>

>Ashcroft
>spent the rest of the Vietnam War in Missouri, safe and
>sound. And quiet: Although Ashcroft was clearly eager to
>avoid going to Vietnam, he never protested the war.
>

Lest see the score board here:

Repubiclans:

Rush Limbough= Donged the draft in Vietnam for "medical reasons"

Goerge W. Bush=got out of military servcie by using his dad's political
connections to get a straight line to a Nation Guard position (ahead of the
other 5,000 slobs who were waiting in line) and a DIRECT COMMISSION as a
fighter pilot! In the REAL WORLD the only people who get direct non-field
commissions are

Doctors, Lawyers, R.N.'s, Dentists, Pharmacists, etc. Not fighter pilots!

Cheney= Dodged the draft in Vietnam. As his confermation hearing to Sec. of
Defense he said he had better thing to do!

Reagan= Dodged the draft in WW II. Despite that many people OLDER and with
serious medical conditios were either drafter or volunteerd adn saw action.

Kemp= got a free educatioin at West Point, made it 4 years there and played
footbal for them. But just as he was to graduate and get commissioned, he
developed a rare medical condition that made him too sick to be in the Army,
but healthy enough to play in the NFL!

Democrates:

Truman= WWI vet

Rooservelt= was only member of his family not to serve due to his polio.

Kennedy= War Hero (P.T. 109)

Johnson= served as a Military Intelligence Officer in the NAvy in the Pacific

Carter= Annopolis Graduate, served 8 Years in teh Navy. Was hand picked out of
the Academy my Rictover (sp?) to help develop the nuclear navy.

Clinton= Dodged the draft.

Were that the score: Serve your country= evil commie

Dodge the draft= greatest defenders of freedom in the Universe!
MSHOTZ: The Post Post Modern Man

"Just think, the next time I shoot someone I could get arrested!"

Lt. Frank Dredin, "The Naked Gun"
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Subject: Re: John Ashcroft: Evangelical, Fascist *and* Coward
From: mshotz@aol.comnospam (James T. Rex King of the Monsters)
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Date: Sun, Dec 16, 2001 3:01 PM
Message-ID: <20011216150158.06364.00000419@mb-cs.aol.com>

When I was in the Army in Germany, we would go to Grafenwher Training area for
4 weeks solid eating nothing but C-Rations, getting 2 to 4 hours of sleep a
night. We would roll in for hot showers and to pack up to go and park in a the
motor pool. Next door would always be a unit with Starched Fatiques, shined
boots, 8 inch knives and bayonetts hanging off their gear, D-rings and other
"Macho" acrutiments hanging off any place you could hang something off of you
Web Gear.

Of course these "Super Troops" were a supply or a signal or a Finance Unit.
And they would be coming in from a tough 7 days in "the field" with 2 hot meals
a day, shower runs, 8 hours of rack time a night, and lot of female troops who
put out! Here we were, just abunch of low-life troops in the 2nd Amored
Caverly Regiment (the old regiment on Continuous Active Duty in the Army)
stationed on the East German-Cech Border. But we were nobodies! These Troops
were the REAL defenders of freedom!

They Signal and Supply Units are the ones that produce the most "hard core"
troops. The ones that assholes like Ashcroft and Bush want! Yea let have a war!
To hell with them grunts! I need the promotion points that a combat tour leads
to!
MSHOTZ: The Post Post Modern Man

"Just think, the next time I shoot someone I could get arrested!"

Lt. Frank Dredin, "The Naked Gun"
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Subject: Re: John Ashcroft: Evangelical, Fascist *and* Coward
From: UnitCLXXX@SputSouth.Com (RevEl)
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Date: Sun, Dec 16, 2001 9:22 PM
Message-ID: <rnlq1ucbmr34tstin35r262a6scvaem5ea@4ax.com>

On 16 Dec 2001 20:12:11 GMT, mshotz@aol.comnospam (James T. Rex King of the
Monsters) wrote, in alt.slack:

>>Ashcroft
>>spent the rest of the Vietnam War in Missouri, safe and
>>sound. And quiet: Although Ashcroft was clearly eager to
>>avoid going to Vietnam, he never protested the war.
>>
>
>Lest see the score board here:

Let's add a link, with a

Who Served:

http://www.awolbush.com/whoserved.html

Prominent Democrats

House Minority Leader Richard Gephardt - Served his country in uniform, 1965-71

House Minority Whip David Bonior - Served his country in uniform, 1968-72

Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle - Served his country in uniform, 1969-72

Vice President Al Gore - Served his country in uniform, 1969-71; recipient of
Vietnam Service Medal

Bob Kerrey... Democrat... Congressional Medal of Honor, VN

Daniel Inouye... Democrat... Congressional Medal of Honor, WW II

John Kerry... Democrat...Silver Star& Bronze Star, VN

Charles Rangel...Democrat... Bronze Star, Korea

Max Cleland... Democrat... Silver Star & Bronze Star, VN

Howell Heflin... Democrat... Silver Star

Rep. Leonard Boswell (D-IA) - two tours in Vietnam, two Distinguished Flying
Crosses as a helicopter pilot, two Bronze Stars, and the Soldier's Medal.
http://www.afji.com/mags/1997/Jan/VietVets.html

Ambassador "Pete" Peterson, Air Force Captain, POW, Democratic congressman,
Ambassador to Viet Nam, and recipient of the Purple Heart, the Silver Star
and the Legion of Merit http://www.af.mil/news/Apr1997/n19970414_970430.html

Rep. Mike Thompson, D-CA: served in combat with the U.S. Army as a staff
sergeant/platoon leader with the 173rd Airborne Brigade; was wounded and
received a Purple Heart. http://www.house.gov/mthompson/bio.html

Prominent Republicans

Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert - avoided the draft, did not serve.

Majority Leader Dick Armey- avoided the draft, did not serve.

Majority Whip Tom Delay - avoided the draft, did not serve.

Senate Majority Minority Leader Trent Lott - avoided the draft, did not serve.

GW bush - decided that a six-year Nat'l Guard commitment really means four years

VP Cheney - several deferments, the last by marriage (in his own words, "had
other priorities than military service")

Att'y Gen. John Ashcroft - sought deferment to teach business ed at SW Missouri
State

Former Speaker Newt Gingrich - avoided the draft, did not serve

"B-1" Bob Dornan - avoided Korean War combat duty by enrolling in college acting
classes (Orange County Register article)

Senator John McCain - McCain's naval honors include the Silver Star, Bronze
Star, Legion of Merit, Purple Heart and Distinguished Flying Cross. Why did
the Bush campaign smear him so?

Former Senator Bob Dole - an honorable man. http://www.bobdole.org/bio/wwII.html

Chuck Hagel - two Purple Hearts and a Bronze Star, Vietnam.
http://www.senate.gov/~hagel/Information/bio.htm

Duke Cunningham - nominated for the Medal of Honor, received the Navy Cross,
two Silver Stars, fifteen Air Medals, the Purple Heart, and several other
decorations http://www.house.gov/cunningham/about_duke.htm#Biography

Re military personnel and public perception of Democrats v. Republicans in
general.

How often must Democrats defend their party against the typical freeper blather
of draft-dodging, service-evading, unpatriotic quakers among us? More often than
we have to.

Gore was right all along. About some things. The "truth" IS on our side.

Or, as www.rackjite.com puts it,

THE CHICKENHAWKS Conservatives make great fun of President Clinton for
questioning the Vietnam War, standing up to his beliefs and questioning his own
participation in that war as well, i.e., being honest and walking the walk of
his own belief system at least for a time. On the other hand there were
literally millions of dishonest hypocritical, cowardly right-wing loonies who
supported the war while refusing to personally participate. Here are just a few:

Elliott Abrams - Sought deferment for bad back.
Richard Armey - Sought college deferment, too smart to die.
Bill Bennett - Sought graduate school deferment, too smart to die.
Pat Buchanan - Sought deferment for bad knee.
George W. Bush - Daddy got him in the reserves.
Dick Cheney - Sought graduate school deferment, too smart to die.
Tom DeLay - - Sought college deferment, too smart to die.
Newt Gingrich - Sought graduate school deferment, too smart to die.
Phil Gramm - Sought marriage deferment, too loved to die.
Jack Kemp - Sought medical deferment while in the NFL.
Rush Limbaugh - Sought deferment for ingrown hair follicle on his ass.
Trent Lott - Sought deferment, didn't want to muss his hair.
Dan Quayle - Family got him into the Reserves.
Pat Robertson - Father pulled him out of Korea as soon as the shooting began.
Kenneth Starr ^ Sought deferment for psoriasis.
John Wayne - Sought deferment to further acting career.
Vin Weber - Sought deferment for asthma.
George Will - Sought deferment, too much of a wussy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: John Ashcroft: Evangelical, Fascist *and* Coward
From: UnitCLXXX@SputSouth.Com (RevEl)
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Date: Sun, Dec 16, 2001 9:22 PM
Message-ID: <knlq1uoue5qi211nsp079p39nh8pi7q2mo@4ax.com>

On 16 Dec 2001 20:12:11 GMT, mshotz@aol.comnospam (James T. Rex King of the
Monsters) wrote, in alt.slack:

>Goerge W. Bush=got out of military servcie by using his dad's political
>connections to get a straight line to a Nation Guard position (ahead of the
>other 5,000 slobs who were waiting in line) and a DIRECT COMMISSION as a
>fighter pilot!

Not only that, but he didn't even serve out his term honorably.

When I discovered this, it really killed any possibility I'd ever
support him (although I had - albeit in retrospect naively - liked
his father - and in some perverted way still do, in spite of what
we've learned since), not that I would have voted for him over Gore
(I like Gore cuz he's actually intelligent, and if he runs again I'll
vote for him for the same reason) anyway, but I didn't realize what
a total shit he was until I found out about his military record.

He was suspended from flying cuz he wouldn't go take a physical.
http://www.talion.com/suspension.html

And there's worse. He just didn't show up for a year or so.

There was substantial research done at the last moment (dammit),
enough to make some of us who've served squint our eyes and spit.

I should add that I don't particularly mind someone Not Serving At
All (ala Clinton, who openly objected, which isn't to say he wasn't
a shithead in other ways).

But to skip out via the National Guard and then not do a good job at
it is just Despicable. And Vile. And Contemptible.

Somehow it seems to me that just Not Serving is more honest than
Pretending and then Doing A Bad Job.

Yeah, I joined during the Vietnam War, so I worked with guys who'd
joined the Guard to get out of the draft, but *most* of them at
least did an decent job of what they were supposed to be doing.

Jeez, in the 27 years since I had to put up with enough shitheads
doing lousy jobs and not even showing up to know the damage it does
to a unit. But enlisted people get Article 15's and reductions.
Officers just get discharged. Sucks, really sucks.

Refs:

http://www.tompaine.com/opinion/2000/09/27/
(I suggest going here with your own browser colors, the site
owner obviously has visual problems)
(this is a fairly clearly stated run-down, though, and lays
out his AWOL status well - Dubyah obviously had some strings
pulled to get out of that one [although from my experience,
it didn't necessarily have to be Big Strings - unfortunately
officers tend to get out of trouble too often by simply being
discharged - sort of a "Good Riddance, No Trouble" action])

http://www.talion.com/georgebush.html
Veterans request George W. Bush Military Records
(see the links at bottom to documents)
(not as clearly written as the one above, but good)

http://www.thedubyareport.com/milserv.html

http://www.dallasnews.com/campaign/092000/208224_attack_06pol.A.html

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/campaign2000/news/One_year_gap_in_Bush_s_Guard_duty+.shtml

http://www.onlinejournal.com/Media/Dawshed10-23-00/dawshed10-23-00.html

http://www.awolbush.com/

Be Honest with the American People, testimony of Senator Bob Kerrey
http://www.herbnstone.com/NoHonor/TestimonyI.htm
is no longer available. Pity. (Better read the rest before Ashcrafty
finds out they're there and has 'em yanked offline.)

I really hate this guy for this shit. Didn't realize it 'til just now.
Oh, knew I thought he was a stoopid dipshit (but very good for the
comedy industry), and last year when I found this out knew I had nothing
but contempt for him. But now, with him bouncing around screaming
WARWARWAR I think he's a disgusting little poppinjay and I long for
the day we UNelect the bastard.

A little boy playing war. That's what he is.

Gawd.

How did we get here?

Threefuckingyears. I guess we just wait.

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Original file name: John Ashcroft- Evangelical, Fa - converted on Thursday, 20 December 2001, 03:31