Subject: A final solution to the Homeland Security problem

From: nu-monet <nothing@succeeds.com>
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Reply-To: like.excess@sex.org
Date: Thu, Oct 18, 2001 5:34 PM

(Mr Larry Ellison is founder and CEO of Oracle Corp.
He has recently met with the Attorney General to
explain his proposals.)

Since the Sept. 11 attacks, our country has been
thrust into a debate over how to root out terrorists
while also maintaining our civil liberties. But
freedom is meaningless in the presence of fear and
intimidation from hostile peoples living and working
in the US. To combat this, one of the suggestions
proposed, though not yet fully debated, is that of
interring all Semitic peoples and those of both the
Jewish and Moslem faiths. This would protect the
nation as a whole and would give these internees a
place of security to live and work and the means to
demonstrate their patriotism through their good
behavior.

Many Americans instinctively fear that internment
of US citizens and legal aliens would sacrifice
basic freedoms and compromise personal liberty. On
the face of it, putting people in institutions does
seem a significant step. Trusting government to
collect such people armed only with their names,
addresses, places of work, amounts and sources of
income, assets, purchases, travel destinations, and
more, seems a huge task. Especially when there are
so many people in question and so many places where
they could hide in this vast nation.

But we should remember that the databases the
government would use already exist, and that we
willingly helped in their creation with the full
expectation that someday it might be necessary to
round up undesireables and people of questionable
loyalty. For years, companies like American Express
and Visa have been issuing cards and building up
information on millions of Americans, frequently
sharing this data with the Federal government.
The Federal government is now, more than ever, able
and willing to take this step for national freedom
and security.

We should remember, too, that the government already
imprisons people--lots of people. Federal, state and
local jails and prisons already provide a safe and
secure institutional environment for millions, with
the capability to comfortably house millions more. The
additional costs of housing and food for internees
should easily be outweighed in the savings to domestic
security. And since internees have committed no crime,
their living conditions will be far better than those
of ordinary criminals, as no punishment is involved.

--
*
Moesha seizes a fresh slice of chef Elise's
greasy fish quiche and mischievously mashes
and squishes it on the Joseph piece of the
fascist police chief's cheezy French crèche.
*
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: A final solution to the Homeland Security problem
From: nu-monet <nothing@succeeds.com>
Newsgroups: alt.slack
Reply-To: like.excess@sex.org
Date: Fri, Oct 19, 2001 11:53 AM
Message-ID: <3BD04C57.7DA3@succeeds.com>

nu-monet wrote:
>

(I wrote the previous article as parody, making fun of
Larry Ellison's self-serving authoritarian ploy for
national ID cards. I had absolutely NO IDEA that someone
would SERIOUSLY contemplate creating CONCENTRATION CAMPS!!!
The following is unedited.)

Britain: Labour government plans to introduce internment
By Richard Tyler
19 October 2001

Last October, the Labour government incorporated the European
Convention on Human Rights into British law. Its passage was
supposed to enshrine certain fundamental civil liberties in
Britain's statute books.

Just one year later, Home Secretary David Blunkett has told
parliament he would be seeking the "derogationo/oo of the
Convention's Article 5 outlawing arbitrary detention and
imprisonment. This would effectively enable the British
authorities to introduce internment~detention without trial
for foreign nationals who are considered a "threat to national
securityo/oo.

The Home Secretary said that the emergency anti-terrorist
legislation was needed for "specific and targeted measures.o/oo
However, the new laws will be cast so broadly that they could
be used not just against alleged terrorists but anyone engaged
in acts of civil disobedience or protest.

Labour is seeking to rush through legislation for the "war
against terrorismo/oo with a minimum of debate or scrutiny.
Speaking in the Commons on Monday, Blunkett announced a
swathe of new measures that overturn basic democratic and
legal norms. This includes an Emergency Anti-Terrorist Bill
and Extradition Bill, expected to be presented to parliament
over the next days, as well as a series of non-legislative
regulations stepping up state powers.

Significantly, the Anti-Terrorist Bill will include an
"enabling power,o/oo allowing measures to be implemented by
"affirmative ordero/oo, i.e. without extensive parliamentary
scrutiny.

Blunkett's speech was a concoction of hypocrisy and barely
concealed threats. "None of those measures is intended to
stifle free speech, dialogue, or debateo/oo, the Home Secretary
claimed, but "There is a compelling need for more effective
powers to exclude and remove suspected terrorists from our
country.o/oo

In the name of defending democracy and safeguarding freedoms,
the Labour government proposes to turn back the clock to a
time when mere suspicion of committing a crime, or an
accusation from those in authority, was sufficient to
justify incarceration. Detention could be based on
membership of the 21 organisations outlawed in the Terrorism
Act 2000, which includes the Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam
and the Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), as well as a host of
Islamic groups such as Hamas.

The Labour government is using the September 11 events to
introduce far harsher asylum and immigration provisions.
Under the emergency legislation, claims for asylum from
those "suspected of terrorist associationso/oo can be rejected
without any recourse to appeal or judicial review. The
state, and its various agencies will become judge, jury
and executioner for those seeking to claim asylum. Once a
refugee is labelled a "terroristo/oo they can be locked up
without the need for a court appearance, or be deported
without any recourse to legal redress.

Blunkett also announced that he would be undertaking a
review of Britain's extradition procedures, with a view
to enabling a suspect's rapid expulsion to a third state.
This forms part of moves initiated at European Union level
to scrap existing national extradition laws and replace
them with an EU arrest warrant that would be recognised
in all 15 member states. It has been mooted that such
warrants might also be extended to enable the authorities
in one EU state to order a search or seizure of goods in
another.

Other non-legislative measures include forcing communication
service providers, such as telecoms firms and Internet
Service Providers, to retain data from their customers for
up to twelve months, which the police and secret services
can then "trawlo/oo though to extract information. This would
include all emails sent or received over an ISPs network,
logs recording an individual's visits to websites, as well
as details of phone and fax calls.

Stressing the need for "good intelligence,o/oo Blunkett said
police would be given access to passenger lists and freight
manifests, with customs and revenue departments also being
able to share data with the police and other agencies. In
addition to strengthening airport security, wider powers
would be granted to British Transport Police, as well as
Ministry of Defence and Atomic Energy Authority police,
enabling them to operate outside their normal jurisdictions.

One insidious proposal is the introduction of a new offence
of "incitement to religious hatredo/oo, punishable by up to
seven years imprisonment. This has been justified by claims
it will be used against those expressing anti-Muslim
sentiments. While it is far more likely to be turned
against more militant Islamic groups, it also has the
potential to stifle any public criticism of religion.

Given the seriousness of the planned legislation, the
response from the liberal media and human rights groups
has been generally limited to the most obvious areas of
potential abuse, such as internment. In the only editorial
comment it has published so far, the Guardian praised
parliament for its "thoughtful, constructive but far from
complacento/oo response to Blunkett's announcement. However,
aside from a handful of backbench Labour MPs, who recently
tabled the mildest criticism of the war (and were rounded
on by the government for doing so), parliament is united
behind the Blair administration in pursuit of the war
against Afghanistan. Only a political naïf should expect
Westminster to champion democratic rights at home while
it is loudly cheering the most brutal acts of war abroad.

It was left to comedians and satirists to make outspoken
criticism of the proposals to introduce "incitement to
religious hatredo/oo legislation. Rowan Atkinson, famous for
his "Mr Beano/oo character, wrote to the Times this week,
"Having spent a substantial part of my career parodying
religious figures from my own Christian background, I am
aghast at the notion that it could, in effect, be made
illegal to imply ridicule of a religion or to lampoon
religious figures.o/oo Atkinson goes on to say that whereas
supporters of the legislation would argue neither he nor
the "comedy worldo/oo were its intended targets, "laws
governing highly subjective or moral issues tend to drag
a very fine net, and some of the most basic freedoms of
speech and expression can get caught up in it.o/oo

In contrast prominent human rights lawyer Geoffrey Bindman,
who was involved in the case to deport General Pinochet
to face trial in Spain, dismissed such concerns for
democratic freedoms, with the assertion, "There will
still be room for humour and rational debate.o/oo In this
he was merely echoing comments by a Home Office spokesman
that there was "no intention to stifle fair comment and
debate, whether satirical or otherwise.o/oo

Blunkett told parliament he would be "examining wider
powers in relation to incitemento/oo and "conspiracy,o/oo two
areas of the law that have produced the most miscarriages
of justice. In future, the powers the state is now
seeking to abrogate to itself with the minimum of
democratic debate or scrutiny can be directed against
all manner of opponents of the government. The last time
"emergencyo/oo anti-terrorist legislation was introduced in
Britain~the 1974 Prevention of Terrorism Act (Temporary
Provisions)~it remained on the statue book for years,
being renewed annually under both Conservative and Labour
governments. It was finally incorporated permanently in
the 2000 Terrorism Act.

The PTA, as the law was known, allowed suspects to be
detained for up to five days without recourse to a lawyer,
and included a form of internal exile, in which people
from Northern Ireland could be "excludedo/oo from visiting
Britain. The British government's pursuit of alleged
"Irish terroristso/oo gave rise to some of the most infamous
miscarriages of justice. Completely innocent people such
as the Birmingham Six or Guildford Four, falsely accused
of having committed bombings, were kept locked up for
over a decade and a half. Labour's new version of the
PTA has all the potential for more such legal travesties.
-
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: A final solution to the Homeland Security problem
From: thereheis99@hotmail.com (Rev. Crawford)

nu-monet <nothing@succeeds.com> wrote in message news:<3BCF4AEF.37A5@succeeds.com>...

> But we should remember that the databases the
> government would use already exist, and that we
> willingly helped in their creation with the full
> expectation that someday it might be necessary to
> round up undesireables and people of questionable
> loyalty. For years, companies like American Express
> and Visa have been issuing cards and building up
> information on millions of Americans, frequently
> sharing this data with the Federal government.
> The Federal government is now, more than ever, able
> and willing to take this step for national freedom
> and security.

Perhaps they could enlist the help of IBM. I understand they've had
some experience with this sort of database management, back in the
late '30's and early '40's in Germany.

-C
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: A final solution to the Homeland Security problem
From: Artemia Salina <y2k@sheayright.com>

You know, the trouble with national ID cards is that one has to be asked
to show it to authorities. That can be very time consuming if/when a
thorough sweep of crowded areas is needed. What's needed is something
more like an ID tag or badge that can be affixed to one's outer clothing.
That way authorities can 'scan' a crowd quickly and easily, therefor
affording more convenience to the public. I think a color coding scheme
would be all that's needed, grouping people into various categories such
as "Islamic", "Christian", "Foreign National", "Indigenous", "Student",
"Unskilled Worker", "ACLU Employee", "Software Executive", etc. And because
many people wear ID cards/badges already, these new National ID Badges should
have a distinctive shape to make them easily distinguishable, say maybe,
star shaped for example.

--
Artemia Salina -- http://www.drpez.com/drali1.htm
'Today I logged on to AOL, and the little voice announced:
"You've got ANTHRAX!"' -- iDRMRSR

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Original file name: A final solution to the Homelan - converted on Thursday, 20 December 2001, 03:31